Forums - The Night Warrior Tales: Storylines of DS (Q & A thread) Show all 62 posts from this thread on one page Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Fan Fiction Library (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=17) -- The Night Warrior Tales: Storylines of DS (Q & A thread) (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=53936) Posted by Siegfried on 02:05:2002 12:01 AM: The Night Warrior Tales: Storylines of DS (Q & A thread) This is the Darkstalkers equivalent of the SF storyline thread. Hopefully this will produce as great a FAQ as the other one. To begin with, here's a great translation of the official All About Vampire Saviour book: http://www.yuzuriha.sakura.ne.jp/~akikan/honyaku1.html Using that, the All About Capcom books and our collective common sense we should be able to figure it out. Posted by Clay on 02:05:2002 12:40 AM: Hey Siegfried. I read through most the link, and it does sound pretty legetimate. It also seems to coincide a lot with what Saiki has been saying. Unfortunately, I'm not going to be much help on this subject, so I'll just keep reading. Credit to Psycho Power J for citing the link to begin with. -Clay Posted by Siegfried on 02:05:2002 12:51 AM: Well, I don't know any more than you after reading the translation, so discussion will come in handy. Does that text imply that Lilith can take male form if she wants to? OMG, here we go again, the Poison debate all over again... Posted by umgogo on 02:05:2002 01:25 AM: Right behind you, Sig. I just downloaded the text, but I haven't read it yet. Frankly, I had no idea there was THAT much official backstory to this series. More later... I think it's time to tuck into Vagrant Story and some pork chops. Posted by TiamatRoar on 02:05:2002 01:34 AM: Ah, I remember this webpage! I've been looking through it a lot. But I lost the URL a while back. Yeeep! Darkstalkers in general is probably going to get a lot more history than Street Fighter because its backstory spans centuries whereas Street Fighter's backstory spans what, a few years before SF1? Also, fantasy type characters almost decree a bigger backstory just to explain how they came to exist, what their cultures are about for each individual race, etc. And instead of being able to use the real world, Capcom has to make worlds from scratch since DS is in alternate dimensions and each of those dimensions need their backstories, too^^ Posted by Grenade Falcon on 02:05:2002 04:02 AM: I just thought of something. Why wasn't Anakaris ranked in Saiki's tier listings? I mean, he's the ruler of his own country and he's got the power to back it up. It does take a certain level of godly power to bury an Egyptian city into the sands, right? Posted by Clay on 02:05:2002 05:14 AM: Yeah, Anakaris is powerful, but Saiki was only mentioning the cream of the crop. According the web page, Anakaris would rank as a B+ class soldier. Everybody that Saiki had mentioned would have been an A class or higher. My guess is that Morrigan+Lilith= A+ Class Both Jedah and a fully completed Morrigan= S Class and Anita might just= S+ Class Even so, who could really compare these to Berial. It's hard to put his dominance into words. -Clay Posted by Grenade Falcon on 02:05:2002 07:48 AM: Okay, I think I'm beginnning to better understand the classes and such. I'm still curious as to why Anakaris would even be considered a Darkstalker. He was never an actual inhabitatant of Makai, was he? All I know is that he was an old Egyptian ruler who died and came back to earth as a pharaoh with enough magical power to take control of his country again. Does this mean that Makai is hell, or rather Capcom's equivalent to it? Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:05:2002 04:31 PM: Let's see... Using the rating for Makai beings, most of the SF cast will be around Class C. Some of the stronger SF are at Class B. The Darkstalkers and the Tier 1 SF characters are around Class B+ to A. When you look at it this way, Akuma and Gill doesn't seem so powerful... Posted by Clay on 02:05:2002 07:57 PM: Yeah, I was going to play a little theory fighter and tier the SF'er into the Vampires castes, but I won't be able to get to it until later tonight. You've got the right idea. Actually, I'm more impressed with Gouki and Oro after seeing the Vampire classes. They started off as Class C slaves and worked and trained themselves into B+ or A material. Where as the Makai nobles were born with supernatural abilities, Gouki and Oro have earned theres. A true testament to the SFer's potential. Gouki and the others haven't shown any signs of slowing down, so I'd like to see this play out a little more if both of the series continued (hopefully) and happened to take place in the same universe. -Clay Posted by Golden Hell on 02:05:2002 09:27 PM: Well, I started reading that link (much thanks to Psycho Power J), but man, getting through it is tough - this really is Engrish at its finest. Its pretty cool though, the parts I'm understanding at least and I hope it is somewhat official. I guess part of this thread will need to be used for deciphering that text, which I'm sure will lead to further discussion. I did like how it explained Ozomu's rise to power within the Doma family. From what I understood, he started out as a sort of servant to Jedah. But then he tricked Jedah into absorbing way too much magical power and eventually self-destructing, giving him the opportunity to take over the family. One question, I thought the Makai was basically the name of the demon world, but in the first sentence of the link it says the "Makai is 'the body of an evil god'". Was I wrong in my understanding of the Makai? Posted by Siegfried on 02:05:2002 09:51 PM: I don't understand the different between all those worlds either. Is Makai their version of Hell? I'd like to know more of the world, if it's a huge chaos, a barren plain (an anime cliche ^_^) or a normal world inhabited by demons. Anyway, if SF and DS does take place in the same universe, that means that Akuma takes his victim to Makai during Shun Goku Satsu. Or? If Makai is indeed a "normal" world, he might pop up out in nowhere, without a demon in sight. Posted by Saiki on 02:05:2002 11:24 PM: Man, I just learned how little I know about this series. Now I have to find out more about it.(Goes to by All About Vampire Savior and All about Vampire). Didn't think their was that much background story on the Vampire series though.... Posted by Grenade Falcon on 02:06:2002 04:12 AM: If I understood that text correctly, Makai is a world so huge that it has yet to be completely explored by its own citizens. Garunan of the Bosital family used to summon Makai beasts and send them to unknown parts of the world to collect environmental info, as well as info regarding the actions of powerful individuals, and bring it back to the Bosital castle. Being that some parts of Makai are uninhabited, they could very well be nothing but barren plane. (Heh, heh, I'm sick of that cartoon.) But then again, Makai's atmosphere could be totally hazardous as it says no human could last even a day there. Maybe it is supposed to be like hell. Akuma sending people to Makai through the Shun Goku Satsu? I like it! If Capcom does make SF and DS interact, that would be the perfect way to do it! Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:06:2002 07:27 AM: If I understand it correctly, it appears to be a normal world (normal for demons anyway) in another dimension. The part about "the body of an evil god" is probably a creation theory (something like God creating world). Apparently, it's not Hell in a sense that souls of dead people go there, because the humans and Makai beings didn't know about each other until the connection between the worlds was discovered. It appears that Darkstalkers are any kind of being with strong powers, because not all Makai beings are called "Darkstalkers", just the the B+ and stronger ones. Posted by Siegfried on 02:06:2002 11:50 AM: Okay, before we go any further into Makai, we need to decide what names to use. I doubt Capcom USA ever bothered to get official translations of all those lords. My suggestions: Belial Aensland Galnan Voshtal Jedah Doma Ozomu Doma Persimon de Lepe Demitri Maximoff Gregorio Hartland Zell Kreutz (reminding a lot of another Zell with a German last name ^_^) Thomas Gray Sierra do Gilman Ed Funechika As for the other names, I suggest we use the Americanized names as with SF. Awww, I envy Saiki who can just go out and buy the damn books. I'd like some myself... Posted by Golden Hell on 02:06:2002 01:47 PM: Good idea, Siegfried. I'll agree with your suggestions cause those are the spelling translations I've become already familiar with (well, at least for the three main families). Obviously, Bosital is Voshtal and so on. And like Siegfried, I too wish I can just go out and purchase these books like Saiki can. I have All About Capcom and All About SNK, can't read them, but its just nice to have as a sort of collection. Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:06:2002 01:52 PM: Japanese (English) Gallon (Jon Talbain) Phobos (Huitzil) Bulleta (B.B.Hood) Aulbath (Rikuo) Posted by Ultima on 02:07:2002 08:28 AM: quote: Originally posted by Siegfried Ozomu Doma I think his US name has already been translated as Ozom (is the jpn. name of his O-Zo-Mu, or O-Zo-Muu?). And personally, I prefer Bosital over any of the other translations, but that's just me. To Psycho Power J: You forgot one: Lei Lei (Hsien Ko). Her sister's name is Lin Lin (Mei Ling) I think. Posted by Siegfried on 02:07:2002 12:25 PM: Alright, it's Ozom then. Still, "Bosital" sounds really lame, and besides it would be "Boshitaru" in normal romanization - Japanese people often make this mistake. I think Umgogo mentioned his name as Voshtal on GameFAQs and he doesn't have the same source as we do. Oh, and here's a scoop for you. Unfortunately I can't show the picture right now (my home computer is messing with me), but have a look at Donovan's Vampire Hunter ending in either the game or in AAC! We see Anita, ten years after VH, dressed in a red dress with yellow buttons, and a big yellow scarf. Sounds familiar? Yep, it's exactly the dress Rose wears. I think I found the source of the Rose=Anita rumor. Now, I don't see anything about it in either of the bios, but maybe Saiki can have a talk with some Capcom guys? It's possible that they were thinking about them being the same character, but changed it. It certainly doesn't fit with Rose hosting Bison's soul and Anita being the savior of the Earth - Bison would have completed Jedah's mission for him. Also, Anita has those evil moments (red glowing eyes when Donovan wins) that I don't see in Rose. Posted by Siegfried on 02:08:2002 03:48 PM: Here's the image: http://www.tekken.nu/fightermania/art/anitarose2.jpg Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:08:2002 09:55 PM: They certainly do look similar. I see that Anita is still carrying her doll. I prefer the English names. In Vampire(Darkstalkers)and Vampire Hunter(Night Warriors)it was Ozom. In Vampire Savior it was Ozomu. Posted by Siegfried on 02:08:2002 10:52 PM: Ummm, she isn't. Sorry for the Rose sprite, it covered the book Anita is holding. In the next picture we see Donovan sitting in a throne with dead people all around him, with the doll on the ground. Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:09:2002 01:25 PM: Siegfried: Ah, I see. On a closer look, it IS a book. Just in case anyone has trouble understanding the text, here's a rundown on the general events that led to the Vampire Series. About 2,000 years ago, a gate between the human and Makai world was discovered. The human world proved to be an unlimited source of energy for Makai beings. It would give anyone power to compete with the Makai lords. So, the three Makai lord decided to seal the Gate. Galnan Voshtal, who control a large information network, guarded the Gate. Eventually the Gate was forgotten and power struggles between the three Makai lords continued. During this time, Morrigan was born. She had enough power to be ranked with the Makai lords. She can't control it though, and no one would allow a child to be a ruler. To protect her, Berial decided to divide her power into three, one part in Morrigan, one in himself, and one sealed in a space he created. Then about a hundred years ago, Galnan Voshtal died. Jedah, one of the two remaining lords, plans to rule Makai. Ozomu convinced him to break the seal on the Gate to gain enough power to defeat Berial, the other remaining Makai lord. Jedah agreed and sent Ozomu to break open a part of the seal. However, Ozomu wants to become a ruler himself, and instead of breaking part of the seal, broke all of it. And when Jedah attempted to absorb the energy, it overloaded and killed him. Ozomu then absorbed what was left of Jedah to gain some power and placed himself as leader of the Doma family. Berial was the only Makai lord that was left. The Makai nobles who were previously under the control of the lords, now wanted to get rid of Berial as well. One of these nobles was Demitri, who gained enough power from the Gate to challenge Berial. They fought violently for days, until Berial realized Demitri's source of power. He then cut it off. The action caused Demitri to be sent to the human world where he recovers for a hundred years. The Vampire series follows after this events. I noticed that the text doesn't cover Donovan. What is his story? Posted by Gen2000 on 02:11:2002 05:39 AM: Awesome thread, I always wanted to know more about the Vampire series, even more about Gallon, one of my fav characters, but I heard his story isn't really related to the series though, is this true? Also, from that pic, Anita does look alittle like Rose, but I wouldn't go all out and say she was/is Rose though, but I do see how the rumor got started though. Speaking of Anita, are there two Anita's in the Vampire series, I already know of the little girl, but I heard of another that is the Savior or whatever, what's up with that? Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:11:2002 09:49 AM: Anita becomes the Light Savior when she reaches adulthood. The Light Savior is suppose to be the future ruler of the human world and destroyer of the Darkstalkers. It's why Donovan is protecting her and Jedah wants to kill her. Posted by Gen2000 on 02:11:2002 11:35 PM: Well, that makese sense, thanks. Also, I read Gallon's story/plot translation on that link from the first post and I'm still confused, but found out that his curse was never lifted even after Darkstalkers 2, but the parts before it, I didn't really understand. The Vampire story is so "huge" and complex, its like biggern than SF and KOF combined almost.. Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:12:2002 03:25 AM: The Vampire storyline is big, but I think what makes it hard to understand is because of the translation in the link. To explain why Jon Talbain still turns into a werewolf, it's because it's not really a curse, it's his true nature. He's a half-werewolf (his mother's human). When he realized that after Pyron was defeated, he stopped thinking it as a curse, but a part of him that needs to be controlled. This is kind of similar to Ryu trying not to resort to the Killing Intent. Posted by Gen2000 on 02:12:2002 07:57 AM: quote: To explain why Jon Talbain still turns into a werewolf, it's because it's not really a curse, it's his true nature. He's a half-werewolf (his mother's human). When he realized that after Pyron was defeated, he stopped thinking it as a curse, but a part of him that needs to be controlled. This is kind of similar to Ryu trying not to resort to the Killing Intent. That would probably explain his "self-battle" at the end of Vampire Savior. Posted by Clay on 02:12:2002 06:24 PM: Hey, haven't been around lately, but I don't really have too much to add. My main problem is with Pyron and how he fits into the story. I can't figure out how exactly he lost to Demitri. Devourer of stars? I would have thought that he would have been too powerful. Anyway, I could come up with theories all day, but I'm wondering if anybody has found any solid information. Perhaps directly from Capcom. I don't think that the games state anything. Perhaps Pyron isn't as powerful as we were lead to believe. Any input is appreciated. -Clay Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:12:2002 10:22 PM: Okay, I've been going around trying to find out more about Pyron. What I've manage to dig up is that Pyron is the supreme overlord of his homeplanet, Hellstorm. I don't know what kind of beings inhabit that place, but they're probably energy-based beings like himself. Pyron appears to have a hobby of conquering worlds wherever he goes. No one was strong enough to oppose him until he came to Earth, where he senses the Darkstalkers. He adopted a humanoid form to battle the Darkstalkers "under Earth's rules", whatever that means. He probably wasn't used holding a humanoid shape, which could be the reason that he could be defeated by Demitri. It's kind of like the SF anime where M.Bison was just pushing Ryu and Ken around with his Psycho Power until he decided to fight them hand-to-hand, at which point he got defeated. Had Pyron just retained his normal state instead of taking humanoid form, Demitri might not have been able to defeat him. About Pyron devouring stars, I don't think he does. He probably just absorb energy from them to sustain himself. I don't think he actually, or is capable of, consuming entire stars. Posted by Saiki on 02:12:2002 11:28 PM: Here's what I know about Pyron from All about Capcom. He was a being who lived on Hellstorm who, through evolution, gained immortality and gained god like abilities. He goes around absorbing energy from stars as a hobby. He see's Earth as his next target for his collection and makes his domain in the deep sea so he can slowly absorb the energy from the earth. He was defeated by Demitri in Vampire 1. This is stated in All about Capcom. It doesn't say how or anything though. I'm hoping All about Vampire Savior will when I get it. Posted by Grenade Falcon on 02:12:2002 11:37 PM: One question that's still buggin' me. How is Anakaris a Darkstalker? Anakaris was the leader of his own country, who died and came back as a powerful pharoah, right? If this is true, he couldn't have been from Makai where all the B+ ranked soldiers come from. Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:13:2002 03:11 AM: If you look at it this way, then half of the DS cast shouldn't be called Darkstalkers, because they aren't from Makai. It's just what they call anyone that is powerful enough to be marked as a Class B+ or stronger. Technically, the Tier 1 SF characters could also be called Darkstalkers. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:17:2002 07:46 AM: Cool It's a very nice thread... Thanks guys for making this thread... Anyway, I just wanna know more about Jedah Doma... Well I heard that Jedah is a god then how he has a father, duh!!! I also heard that he was defeated by Demitri in the game storyline, I heard that at gcc... Anyway here is alot of thing that I know about Jedah... Jedah, who was resurrected in the barren outskirts of Makai, laments over a miserable state he has foreseen for the next world, which will be perched on the verge of destruction. "It is foolish and meaningless to fight and plunder each other. No one can save this world except me," he grumbles. To save all forms of life, every soul needs to be united so as to become one soul; only then will the world be without violent conflict. However, Jedah required a durable container that is capable of holding all the souls in order to prevent him from from making the same mistake that he made with Berial, the Evil King, 100 years previously. Jedah came up with an idea of collecting the most valuable souls, and then uniting himself to their combined essence, creating one container large enough to safely confine all the other souls. With benevolence in mind, Jedah lands on his feet within the dark entity. The travelling black void is itself the container called majigen, the spiritual creation of Jedah. "Join with my soul if you desire peace and tranquility for all time!" http://www.gizba.com/x/lorddragon/ljedah.gif Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:17:2002 05:04 PM: Dark LordDragon: There is a link on page one of this thread as well as a summary of the events before the Vampire Series started. Link's a bit difficult to understand though. Jedah's mistake was before he was about to fight Berial, he absorbed too much energy from the gate between the human and demon world and blew himself up. Jedah description is "Messiah of Darkness", who aims to "save" the demon world by fusing all the souls together as well as destroying the human world. I don't know how demons are born so I'm not sure about where they come from. As for who wins, it is either Demitri or Morrigan(Probably Demitri, Morrigan just finds Lilith). Can't be too sure until the sequel comes out. I can't understand Donovan's story. He's introduction in Vampire Savior says he heard a voice coming from Anita's sleeping body and had his soul pulled into her consiousness. Then his ending has him trying to wake Anita up. There doesn't seem anything that says he fought in Majigen. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:17:2002 08:41 PM: quote: Originally posted by Psycho Power J Dark LordDragon: There is a link on page one of this thread as well as a summary of the events before the Vampire Series started. Link's a bit difficult to understand though. Jedah's mistake was before he was about to fight Berial, he absorbed too much energy from the gate between the human and demon world and blew himself up. Jedah description is "Messiah of Darkness", who aims to "save" the demon world by fusing all the souls together as well as destroying the human world. I don't know how demons are born so I'm not sure about where they come from. As for who wins, it is either Demitri or Morrigan(Probably Demitri, Morrigan just finds Lilith). Can't be too sure until the sequel comes out. I can't understand Donovan's story. He's introduction in Vampire Savior says he heard a voice coming from Anita's sleeping body and had his soul pulled into her consiousness. Then his ending has him trying to wake Anita up. There doesn't seem anything that says he fought in Majigen. Thanks for these informations, I read the stories, but it seems that Jedah was the weakest LORD, how can that be!? Berial and Demitri were the true bosses, anyway whatever about Pyron... I think he hates Jedah alot, can you explain why ? Thanks Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:18:2002 11:42 AM: That's because Jedah is also the youngest of the three lords. He's about 6,000 years old(relatively young for a demon). Berial and Galnan/Garunan are actually the two other lords and all three are at Class S. Demitri is just a noble at Class A and weaker than Jedah. Demitri was only able to gain enough power to compete with Berial by channeling the energy of the Gate, but still lost anyway and got sent to the human world by accident when he was defeated. Pyron doesn't really hate Jedah. He actually didn't have anything to do with Jedah in the first place. You can see it in his ending, he just want to conquer te devil world, but found out there is nothing to obtain there. I'm not sure as to what extent Pyron is involved with the story, but I don't think he actually fought Jedah, nor blew up the devil world. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:19:2002 02:33 AM: quote: Originally posted by Psycho Power J That's because Jedah is also the youngest of the three lords. He's about 6,000 years old(relatively young for a demon). Berial and Galnan/Garunan are actually the two other lords and all three are at Class S. Demitri is just a noble at Class A and weaker than Jedah. Demitri was only able to gain enough power to compete with Berial by channeling the energy of the Gate, but still lost anyway and got sent to the human world by accident when he was defeated. Pyron doesn't really hate Jedah. He actually didn't have anything to do with Jedah in the first place. You can see it in his ending, he just want to conquer te devil world, but found out there is nothing to obtain there. I'm not sure as to what extent Pyron is involved with the story, but I don't think he actually fought Jedah, nor blew up the devil world. Thanks for these informations... I don't like to make a flame war or something but who is much stronger by the storyline, Orochi or Jedah... Remember not game-wise Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:19:2002 03:05 AM: Dark LordDragon: Kind of hard to say. Both can come back to life, both wield awesome powers, and both could wipe out any SF/KOF character. And also, both can wipe out the human world. There isn't really a standard of comparison. However, if Jedah manages to collect enough souls in Majigen and then fuses with it, he could probably overpower Orochi. Orochi's capabilities is only limited in being capable of destroying the human world, but with all the souls of the devil world fused with him, Jedah could probably destroy both the human and devil world. Posted by Saiki on 02:19:2002 03:58 AM: Lord Dragon I'll explain with much better detail why I said Orochi would beat Jedah at gamefaqs. Orochi is an entity which cannot take a physical form in the human world. Orochi is the will of Earth itself. Orochi possess the power to turn everything into nothingness and can also bend space. But like I said earlier, Orochi cannot take a physical form in the human world so he cannot use his full power. Now if we assume that the Capcom world and SNK world were one, Orochi would most likely be living in Makai. This would mean that Orochi would be able to use it's full potential living in Makai. The characters in Darkstalkers that Jedah fears and cannot defeat is Belial and the Light Savior(Anita). Anita, if she awakens to her true powers, can also bend time and space. If Jedah cannot defeat the Light Savior(who basically has the same powers as full Orochi), I would assume that Jedah cannot defeat full Orochi as well. And as a side note, Pyron probably doesn't even know about Jedah. Unless Capcom changed the story again, Pyron was consumed by Demitri after he was defeated by Demitri. Hence why Demitri was so confident of beating Belial when he went back to Makai. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:19:2002 10:44 AM: quote: Originally posted by Saiki Lord Dragon I'll explain with much better detail why I said Orochi would beat Jedah at gamefaqs. Orochi is an entity which cannot take a physical form in the human world. Orochi is the will of Earth itself. Orochi possess the power to turn everything into nothingness and can also bend space. But like I said earlier, Orochi cannot take a physical form in the human world so he cannot use his full power. Now if we assume that the Capcom world and SNK world were one, Orochi would most likely be living in Makai. This would mean that Orochi would be able to use it's full potential living in Makai. The characters in Darkstalkers that Jedah fears and cannot defeat is Belial and the Light Savior(Anita). Anita, if she awakens to her true powers, can also bend time and space. If Jedah cannot defeat the Light Savior(who basically has the same powers as full Orochi), I would assume that Jedah cannot defeat full Orochi as well. And as a side note, Pyron probably doesn't even know about Jedah. Unless Capcom changed the story again, Pyron was consumed by Demitri after he was defeated by Demitri. Hence why Demitri was so confident of beating Belial when he went back to Makai. Yeah Orochi just take his true look when he enter in the bodies... I know what you mean, but I heard Orochi's true form is a Hydra with 8 heads, and who knows maybe his moves change too, About Jedah, well I don't think Jedah fear to face Belial the matter is he want to rule them all so he wanted to remove Belial, that's true maybe Belial is much stronger but who said that he can beat him all the time, as Kyo and Iori who said that they can beat Orochi all the time, if that's so then I think Orochi is weak... And I don't think that Anita has the same power as Berial have... But you are right, if Orochi was in the Mokai world that would make change but since he is not what is your answer!? Anyway, Pyron isn't one of the three lords clans then why people think he is much stronger than Demitri of course by the storyline, I don't think Demitri is weaker... Anyway thanks for these informations... Keep going man quote: Dark LordDragon: Kind of hard to say. Both can come back to life, both wield awesome powers, and both could wipe out any SF/KOF character. And also, both can wipe out the human world. There isn't really a standard of comparison. However, if Jedah manages to collect enough souls in Majigen and then fuses with it, he could probably overpower Orochi. Orochi's capabilities is only limited in being capable of destroying the human world, but with all the souls of the devil world fused with him, Jedah could probably destroy both the human and devil world. SO you think it's a draw match or Maybe Jedah can win, I honestly agree with you, but take in note that I like Orochi more, anyway Orochi's power is unlimited and Jedah's power count on the souls, when the souls will end Jedah's power will end as well, but when the souls will end!!! I like Capcom when they make a character like this... Anyway it's cool to hear that Jedah is the strongest one in Capcom side, I hope to see him as the final boss from Capcom side and Orochi from SNK side as the final bosses in CvS series, it will be awesome... Posted by Siegfried on 02:20:2002 04:45 PM: Jedah as a character is more powerful than Orochi (although he is limited by being in a human body). He cuts his head off as a counter and squirts his blood at the opponent. Orochi had to gather a lot of "fighting power" or whatever to be able to resurrect. Jedah does it at will. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:20:2002 10:35 PM: quote: Originally posted by Siegfried Jedah as a character is more powerful than Orochi (although he is limited by being in a human body). He cuts his head off as a counter and squirts his blood at the opponent. Orochi had to gather a lot of "fighting power" or whatever to be able to resurrect. Jedah does it at will. So you think Jedah will win good, anyway I just read at gamefaqs that Pyron and Jedah are not using their true form and real powers, is that mean they are much stronger than that!!!! They said that Pyron just wanted to have some fun on earth he doesn't used his powers so he was defeated by Demitri or maybe Donovan... Did that mean he is much stronger than Jedah!? Posted by Saiki on 02:21:2002 12:54 AM: Lord Dragon Jedah did fear Belial, thats why Jedah didn't challenge Belial once when he was alive. He only tried when he found out about the unlimited source of energy from the human world. Jedah is using his real and full form. The only reason he is using the Shintai(the fetus) is because his body cannot handle the nergy needed to take on the Light Savior(Anita). Pyron wasn't holding back or anything when he was defeated by Demitri. Pyron just took a physical form of a human. It was actually Demitri who wasn't using his full potential when he defeated Pyron. Demitris real form is his demonic bat form which he can only have in Makai. When in human form, his powers is limited. Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:21:2002 01:30 AM: Dark LordDragon: It's unsure how strong Pyron is, but when he was in humanoid form, he was weaker than Demitri. He restricted himself to fight the Darkstalkers on their level, making it possible for him to be defeated. I'm not sure about the being absorbed part, but he was defeated by Demitri and probably dead. I think that Jedah is using his true form and powers. He seems to have a liquid body that could change shape as well as allow instant regeneration, which would explain his bizare abilities. Of course he could resurrect himself as well. He could also become stronger by absorbing souls. He created Majigen and the Shintai to contain all the souls of the demon world. If he was able to fuse with it when it contain a large number of souls, he could equal or exceed Berial's strength. Orochi of SNK was based on an actual legend of the eight-headed Orochi Dragon. However, in the game, his true form was just that, a powerful long-haired guy who floats. He doesn't get any stronger than that. And while he could blow away all non-top tier SF/KOF cast, he certainly couldn't match Berial and the Light Savior in strength if he was defeated by Kyo and Iori. I don't know about him being the will of the Earth, but he was said to be a messenger of the gods. So to sum it up, the Light Savior reigns supreme (since Berial appear to have died). And maybe the Shintai if Jedah ever gets around to collecting enough souls. Edit: Demitri was using his real form. Just because he looks human doesn't mean he is in a human body. Same way with Morrigan. Just because she looks human doesn't mean that she is in human body. Posted by Dark LordDragon on 02:21:2002 02:58 AM: quote: Originally posted by Psycho Power J Dark LordDragon: It's unsure how strong Pyron is, but when he was in humanoid form, he was weaker than Demitri. He restricted himself to fight the Darkstalkers on their level, making it possible for him to be defeated. I'm not sure about the being absorbed part, but he was defeated by Demitri and probably dead. I think that Jedah is using his true form and powers. He seems to have a liquid body that could change shape as well as allow instant regeneration, which would explain his bizare abilities. Of course he could resurrect himself as well. He could also become stronger by absorbing souls. He created Majigen and the Shintai to contain all the souls of the demon world. If he was able to fuse with it when it contain a large number of souls, he could equal or exceed Berial's strength. Orochi of SNK was based on an actual legend of the eight-headed Orochi Dragon. However, in the game, his true form was just that, a powerful long-haired guy who floats. He doesn't get any stronger than that. And while he could blow away all non-top tier SF/KOF cast, he certainly couldn't match Berial and the Light Savior in strength if he was defeated by Kyo and Iori. I don't know about him being the will of the Earth, but he was said to be a messenger of the gods. So to sum it up, the Light Savior reigns supreme (since Berial appear to have died). And maybe the Shintai if Jedah ever gets around to collecting enough souls. Edit: Demitri was using his real form. Just because he looks human doesn't mean he is in a human body. Same way with Morrigan. Just because she looks human doesn't mean that she is in human form. All I know about Pyron that he takes his energy from stars and stuff, but I heard at gamefaqs that he eat stars... WELL WTF!? Is Beliel a light savior ? Orochi was sent to earth by his sister, his true form is a dragon with eight heads, that's all I know about Orochi, so he is trying to make his sister Happy... As I understand from you that Orochi's power is limited... I still don't know how could Demitri defeat Pyron!? Well one of you says Demitri was using his true form and Saiki said no, who is right now ? Well I think he doesn't used his real form, anyway... Thanks for these informations, I like this thread... Keep going guys... Ok guys why you don't post your top 3 storyline bosses in fighting games: (Of course without Beliel and the guyse that doesn't appear in the game) Here is mine: 1-Jedah 2-Pyron 3-Orochi Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:22:2002 03:11 PM: 1 - Orochi 2 - Jedah 3 - Pyron Anita is the Light Savior when she grows up. I think that Demitri is using his true form because in the game, he you could see him demonic form whenever he does a super. I don't think he is limited to using that form in Makai. Most of what I know about Orochi came from GameFAQs: http://www.gamefaqs.com/coinop/arcade/game/10679.html Look under Story Guide by KLantis. I'm just stating what I know from that. Posted by umgogo on 02:25:2002 01:06 AM: Comparing the KOF and Darkstalkers universes is roughly equal to placing the Marvel world next to that of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. The power level of KOF is infinitely lower than Darkstalkers', and the latter's story is considerably more substantial (almost too much so, one could argue). The Orochi is the most powerful being the KOF universe has ever seen and (in all likelihood) ever will see, but it is limited to a certain range of actions (and conceivably a fixed area of operation - I doubt it could travel to Makai). Its essence is linked to that of the Earth itself (as much as I dislike this particular story tidbit... damn FFVII-esque "soul of the planet" issues... seem to be the plot of choice in '97), and it seemingly has little will of its own. Strictly speaking, it is not an autonomous, sentient being - merely a force of nature that does its level best to defend the Earth from the folly of mankind's excesses. (Honestly, I suspect that some devoted Nakoruru fanboy was involved in the KOF '97 script...) At any rate, it draws its power from the planet ("Gaia", as it puts it) and the energy of its followers, and directs it towards perceived threats. Despite its formidability, it has been defeated and sealed away at a few points in history - by human beings, who would rank very low on the Darkstalkers power scale. (Lower than the demigod Gill, the accomplished Senjin Oro and the demonic Akuma, I would say, although I imagine the Orochi itself to be infinitely more powerful than any of those... the Kusanagis/Hasshakus/Yatas were DESTINED to take it down, which is why they succeeded.) This is most likely not related to it being forced to assume a physical shape, but simply due to the fact that Armageddon (and thus Orochi) isn't needed... yet. I take it the Orochi will rise to annihilate mankind the day it becomes clear that the planet cannot take it anymore. (I'm telling you, an overpowering fear of an impending apocalypse must be a prerequisite for becoming a writer of fighting game scripts. Gill's doomsday cult, Guilty Gear's overpopulation and Gear revolts/wars, Mortal Kombat's outer-dimensional invasions...) If Jedah or whoever somehow managed to come around for a scrap, the Orochi would doubtlessly put up one hell of a fight, but I believe it would succumb in the end, since it was not meant to fight off otherwordly menaces. Bottom line: The Orochi isn't cut out to handle Makai's level of badness, but it would just about tear every force in every other fighting game series to shreds... as long as said force posed a threat to Gaia. If you are a part of this world, the Orochi potentially ownz you, simple as that. And yes, I preferred it when the Orochi was pictured as an agent of evil and corruption ('95/'96) rather than the planet's blind, primitive defense system, but I think it's time for me to shut up now... Posted by Psycho Power J on 02:27:2002 04:30 PM: ...so the Orochi is the KOF equivalent of FFVII WEAPONS? I guess I'm wrong about the "messenger of the gods" part. Yeah, I also prefer the Orochi being an evil entity instead of a mindless force. It's hard to imagine a mindless force being able to do the intelligent decision to arouse the Riot of the Blood in Iori and turn him against Kyo. Posted by Gen2000 on 03:01:2002 04:38 AM: About Demitri using his true form, I think he was too, cause the form in the game doesn't look that human at all, at least in Vampire Savior. He seems to have some huge scar/bump/something over one of his eyes. I don't know if he is supposed to have that there or if it was caused by the battle he had with Belial. Btw, if you don't know what I'm talking about, you can see it during his versus pic in that game. Posted by Psycho Power J on 03:02:2002 03:08 AM: No. A shadow is cast over one side of his face and that's his eye glowing. Still, that and the aura that surrounds him hints that he's not human. Besides, he's a vampire, and even though vampires look human, they're not. Question: What are the figures that form when Donovan does his techniques? Are they spirits he summoned or extensions of his aura? Posted by Grenade Falcon on 03:13:2002 09:29 AM: I thought I should bump this thread back up with a question that came to mind. Does anyone else doubt that there will be a DS4? From the look of things, hardly anyone plays Vampire Savior at the arcades, let alone host VS tourneys, because the game engine plays like it wants to have all the over-the-top Marvel-style elements, yet still have a certain amount of depth to it. It's basically just any two characters trying to win by doing relatively the same magic series combo the most times, without having to use specials or even EX Specials. Capcom could change this by reverting to the original Darkstalkers game engine, but then a lot of VS fans could find their attention being turned away from the old-school feel and the loss of hype, despite what new characters or features are put into it. If it's not because of gameplay, then it might be the casual SF gamers to blame for not recognizing the DS characters and labeling this series as a Street Fighter rip-off. No fighting game has to be enjoyable with Ryu or Ken, but there are so many who feel insecure about playing Capcom fighters without them. The way I see it, Darkstalkers is dead as a fighting game series. Whatever the reason may be, it certainly hasn't gained enough money compared to Capcom's other titles. However, if Capcom is planning a continuation of the DS series, one could hope that they'd rebuild it under a different genre, like survival horror for instance, and let the story move on from there instead of making it another fighting game. The Darkstalkers are going to perish at some point in time, so let Anita fulfill her purpose in life and dispose of them with her power. Does anyone else agree? Posted by Siegfried on 03:13:2002 06:01 PM: No way! Capcom already has four survival horror series that they'll milk for decades. Resident Evil, Dino Crisis, Onimusha and Devil May Cry. Darkstalkers is a cartoony fighter with amazing character designs. Let it continue that way... some day... Posted by Psycho Power J on 03:13:2002 07:23 PM: quote: Originally posted by Grenade Falcon I thought I should bump this thread back up with a question that came to mind. Does anyone else doubt that there will be a DS4? From the look of things, hardly anyone plays Vampire Savior at the arcades, let alone host VS tourneys, because the game engine plays like it wants to have all the over-the-top Marvel-style elements, yet still have a certain amount of depth to it. It's basically just any two characters trying to win by doing relatively the same magic series combo the most times, without having to use specials or even EX Specials. Capcom could change this by reverting to the original Darkstalkers game engine, but then a lot of VS fans could find their attention being turned away from the old-school feel and the loss of hype, despite what new characters or features are put into it. If it's not because of gameplay, then it might be the casual SF gamers to blame for not recognizing the DS characters and labeling this series as a Street Fighter rip-off. No fighting game has to be enjoyable with Ryu or Ken, but there are so many who feel insecure about playing Capcom fighters without them. The way I see it, Darkstalkers is dead as a fighting game series. Whatever the reason may be, it certainly hasn't gained enough money compared to Capcom's other titles. However, if Capcom is planning a continuation of the DS series, one could hope that they'd rebuild it under a different genre, like survival horror for instance, and let the story move on from there instead of making it another fighting game. The Darkstalkers are going to perish at some point in time, so let Anita fulfill her purpose in life and dispose of them with her power. Does anyone else agree? I don't. Capcom's profits also include what they get from other countries. While it may not be that popular in the U.S., I know that it is popular in other countries, especially Japan. As long as anyone is willing to buy the games and put some money in Capcom's pocket, they will continue making the games. Of course, since it's Capcom, I expect things like reused sprites and unoriginal backgrounds. As long as the gameplay is good, I won't complain (too much). Posted by Grenade Falcon on 03:13:2002 11:09 PM: I understand the concern, but how is Capcom going to continue the series the way it is when they've already taken it in a direction that turned most gamers off? Even Japanese players hardly take the time to meddle with it. In some instances, it's the demands of the casual gamers who don't know what the hell they're asking for that force Capcom to make their games under heavier circumstances, hence, the reason why we see so much of the same SF2 cast being used game after game, after game. This is also probably why their storylines aren't as clearly developed as they'd have originally intended. If they had had more freedom to do what they want with SF and not have to focus so much on what they should do to stay in the arcade business, there wouldn't be so many lame SNK fanboys jumping on the anti-Capcom bandwagon, who never give Capcom a chance. It just sickens me to hear shit like "Kyo would own Akuma!", or "Ryu would lose against any SNK character because he's just a bum and SNK's characters are a lot cooler!". If SNK is that dominant over Capcom, then what's the point of having a crossover?! Fuck! Darkstalkers is a fine series altogether, but ironically, it's the majority of people they're making it for that turn away from it, even if it does well in other countries. But in all seriousness, I too hope Capcom comes up with a way to keep it going, even if it means having it interact with Street Fighter for the first time (which would actually be cool to see! ). Posted by TiamatRoar on 03:13:2002 11:27 PM: Ugh... I'm starting to get really really tired of SNK fanboys screaming that KOF's storyline kicks Street Fighter's storyline's ass. I used to believe them, but now, after I've looked over the KOF storyline and the Street Fighter storyline and compared them... at the very most, one shouldn't be saying that the KOF storyline owns Street Fighter's for free. I personally am starting to really side with the SF storyline as I learn more and more about both. And the Darkstalkers storyline seems interesting, too. If only Capcom could find ways to present them better in games... Posted by Clay on 03:18:2002 08:55 PM: Tiamat: I totally agree. I have always preferred the SF story, but that's just my own personal bias. What most people need to realize is that SF does have a decent story to it, it's just that Snk has been a lot better at displaying theirs. Like you, I hope that Capcom will improve on this. -Clay Posted by Gen2000 on 04:09:2002 08:43 PM: This thread is too good to die out. Also, I agree, Capcom games like SFer and Vampire Savoir has excellent storylines, but the problem is the Capcom of USA messes it up or Capcom just doesn't know how to present them (hey, it is a fighting game after all, not a soap opera, heh). Posted by Psycho Power J on 04:10:2002 10:26 PM: Nice to see this thread hasn't gone extinct yet. As for the storyline, the Vampire series, like every fighting game by Capcom, is good but not very clear. Some endings like J.Talbain's needs some figuring out. They are good though, and I like how J.Talbain is going through something like the Satsui no Hadou. By the way, how did Donovoan meet Anita? I know the anime isn't canon, but Anita is carrying that headless doll of hers. Does that mean Donovan really saved her or did he met her another way? Posted by AKUMA2000 on 04:17:2002 06:21 AM: quote: Originally posted by TiamatRoar Ugh... I'm starting to get really really tired of SNK fanboys screaming that KOF's storyline kicks Street Fighter's storyline's ass. I used to believe them, but now, after I've looked over the KOF storyline and the Street Fighter storyline and compared them... at the very most, one shouldn't be saying that the KOF storyline owns Street Fighter's for free. I personally am starting to really side with the SF storyline as I learn more and more about both. And the Darkstalkers storyline seems interesting, too. If only Capcom could find ways to present them better in games... Agreed.......the SF storylines own, and i also wish capcom would present them better in the games Posted by Gen2000 on 04:23:2002 08:10 AM: quote: Originally posted by Psycho Power J Nice to see this thread hasn't gone extinct yet. As for the storyline, the Vampire series, like every fighting game by Capcom, is good but not very clear. Some endings like J.Talbain's needs some figuring out. They are good though, and I like how J.Talbain is going through something like the Satsui no Hadou. By the way, how did Donovoan meet Anita? I know the anime isn't canon, but Anita is carrying that headless doll of hers. Does that mean Donovan really saved her or did he met her another way? Well at first, I was gonna say you could check up on the profiles from the link on the first page, but now that I looked it they don't even have bios for Donovan or Anita (except that she is the Light Savior). I just glance over it, but you probably have to fully read it to see them being mentioned. But not having personal bios for them like the other Darkstalkers is kinda weird. J.Talbain (I perfer Gallon, hehe) storyline is indeed weird and cool at the same time. All times are GMT. The time now is 12:51 AM. Show all 62 posts from this thread on one page Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.2.4 Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Limited 2000, 2001.